Datasets:

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innovation-hacking2

/

shitposting_dataset5

like 0

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr…." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well" ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?" ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao" ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\"." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?" ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!" ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!" ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers.", ">\n\nI usually just fast forward all the “life stories”" ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers.", ">\n\nI usually just fast forward all the “life stories”", ">\n\nyeah, I can agree with this, if it’s just emotional shit, I mean sure it’s sad but if it’s not actual talent, throw them the fuck out." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers.", ">\n\nI usually just fast forward all the “life stories”", ">\n\nyeah, I can agree with this, if it’s just emotional shit, I mean sure it’s sad but if it’s not actual talent, throw them the fuck out.", ">\n\nThe place I noticed this the most was in American Ninja Warrior. 9 times out of 10, anyone with an emotional backstory attached to them will either finish the course or at the very least, fail in some late stages with the hosts acting surprised." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers.", ">\n\nI usually just fast forward all the “life stories”", ">\n\nyeah, I can agree with this, if it’s just emotional shit, I mean sure it’s sad but if it’s not actual talent, throw them the fuck out.", ">\n\nThe place I noticed this the most was in American Ninja Warrior. 9 times out of 10, anyone with an emotional backstory attached to them will either finish the course or at the very least, fail in some late stages with the hosts acting surprised.", ">\n\nI agrée but i think this is on the show, not the contestant. I feel line every show has gone off the rails after a few seasons to the sob stories." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers.", ">\n\nI usually just fast forward all the “life stories”", ">\n\nyeah, I can agree with this, if it’s just emotional shit, I mean sure it’s sad but if it’s not actual talent, throw them the fuck out.", ">\n\nThe place I noticed this the most was in American Ninja Warrior. 9 times out of 10, anyone with an emotional backstory attached to them will either finish the course or at the very least, fail in some late stages with the hosts acting surprised.", ">\n\nI agrée but i think this is on the show, not the contestant. I feel line every show has gone off the rails after a few seasons to the sob stories.", ">\n\nA person's story is part of what makes them, its much better than just some superficial surface level image" ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers.", ">\n\nI usually just fast forward all the “life stories”", ">\n\nyeah, I can agree with this, if it’s just emotional shit, I mean sure it’s sad but if it’s not actual talent, throw them the fuck out.", ">\n\nThe place I noticed this the most was in American Ninja Warrior. 9 times out of 10, anyone with an emotional backstory attached to them will either finish the course or at the very least, fail in some late stages with the hosts acting surprised.", ">\n\nI agrée but i think this is on the show, not the contestant. I feel line every show has gone off the rails after a few seasons to the sob stories.", ">\n\nA person's story is part of what makes them, its much better than just some superficial surface level image", ">\n\nIf they only showed the performances the show would be 20 mins max. Actually that might make for a better show." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers.", ">\n\nI usually just fast forward all the “life stories”", ">\n\nyeah, I can agree with this, if it’s just emotional shit, I mean sure it’s sad but if it’s not actual talent, throw them the fuck out.", ">\n\nThe place I noticed this the most was in American Ninja Warrior. 9 times out of 10, anyone with an emotional backstory attached to them will either finish the course or at the very least, fail in some late stages with the hosts acting surprised.", ">\n\nI agrée but i think this is on the show, not the contestant. I feel line every show has gone off the rails after a few seasons to the sob stories.", ">\n\nA person's story is part of what makes them, its much better than just some superficial surface level image", ">\n\nIf they only showed the performances the show would be 20 mins max. Actually that might make for a better show.", ">\n\nThey don't \"use emotional stories to convince judges.\" They are told to by producers. There have been many Xfactor contestants who have come out and said producers spun a bogus sobstory for them." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers.", ">\n\nI usually just fast forward all the “life stories”", ">\n\nyeah, I can agree with this, if it’s just emotional shit, I mean sure it’s sad but if it’s not actual talent, throw them the fuck out.", ">\n\nThe place I noticed this the most was in American Ninja Warrior. 9 times out of 10, anyone with an emotional backstory attached to them will either finish the course or at the very least, fail in some late stages with the hosts acting surprised.", ">\n\nI agrée but i think this is on the show, not the contestant. I feel line every show has gone off the rails after a few seasons to the sob stories.", ">\n\nA person's story is part of what makes them, its much better than just some superficial surface level image", ">\n\nIf they only showed the performances the show would be 20 mins max. Actually that might make for a better show.", ">\n\nThey don't \"use emotional stories to convince judges.\" They are told to by producers. There have been many Xfactor contestants who have come out and said producers spun a bogus sobstory for them.", ">\n\nThe only \"real\" acts on these shows are the bad ones. The others are explicitly directed by the show producers.\nThere are stories of bad acts finding out that they were invited soley to be made fun of on stage." ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers.", ">\n\nI usually just fast forward all the “life stories”", ">\n\nyeah, I can agree with this, if it’s just emotional shit, I mean sure it’s sad but if it’s not actual talent, throw them the fuck out.", ">\n\nThe place I noticed this the most was in American Ninja Warrior. 9 times out of 10, anyone with an emotional backstory attached to them will either finish the course or at the very least, fail in some late stages with the hosts acting surprised.", ">\n\nI agrée but i think this is on the show, not the contestant. I feel line every show has gone off the rails after a few seasons to the sob stories.", ">\n\nA person's story is part of what makes them, its much better than just some superficial surface level image", ">\n\nIf they only showed the performances the show would be 20 mins max. Actually that might make for a better show.", ">\n\nThey don't \"use emotional stories to convince judges.\" They are told to by producers. There have been many Xfactor contestants who have come out and said producers spun a bogus sobstory for them.", ">\n\nThe only \"real\" acts on these shows are the bad ones. The others are explicitly directed by the show producers.\nThere are stories of bad acts finding out that they were invited soley to be made fun of on stage.", ">\n\nI wouldn’t be surprised if the sob stories on talent shows are made up by the producers themselves" ]

[ "\"I was born at a very young age\"\n*Golden buzzer*", ">\n\n\"It was so traumatizing, that I couldn't speak or walk for two years\"", ">\n\nI was born in a coffee can under a bridge...?", ">\n\nYes this exactly", ">\n\nThe show picks them because of these stories. They are being exploited for the emotional sob stories. That’s what keeps the plebs coming back to watch. It’s not to see the billionth talented singer.", ">\n\nOP definitely watches WWE and thinks it isn't scripted.", ">\n\nWWE wrestlers are my favourite natural athletes", ">\n\nThere's so many of them now that it's practically a competition in itself to see who has the saddest sob story", ">\n\nWait you actually think it's real?\nThe producers of the show get them to say that stuff, it's not for the judges, it's for you to find the show more entertaining. It's all fake, they basically get told what to do and what to say.\nIf you're in the US it's ever worse, it can all be fake and make believe.", ">\n\nThey are told what to sing as well. Even if they tell the audience otherwise.", ">\n\nThe whole thing is a waste of time anyway, it's for entertainment purposes only. Audiences would rather have an amazing sob story and medoirce talent than normalish people with amazing talent. Its the perfect venue to root for the underdog, hence why it's so prevalent", ">\n\nIt's actually the producers that look for the sad stories as they feel it makes better television. If the contestant is not talented then no amount of sad story is gonna win them a place in the next round.", ">\n\nThey were picked specifically for those sob stories.", ">\n\nMy friend was a finalist on the Voice a couple years ago and they totally milked the crap outta their mom’s death in their application", ">\n\nI’ve seen a guy talk about how hard the year has been and his stacking bills he has on the cooking competition show “Chopped” only to lose to the guy who wants to use the money for a vacation, so I dont think it sways judges too heavily", ">\n\nThe producers seek them out and encourage them to tell those stories. It's part of the show.", ">\n\nThe contestants aren't doing this independently in order to sway judges. These are TV shows, that stuff is encouraged by producers in order to add drama for the audience. It's contrived and intentional by those running the show.", ">\n\nExactly", ">\n\nI agree. I'm sick of hearing the \"my (insert loved one) died and I'm doing this to honor their memory\" stories.", ">\n\nHell yes to this. I hate hearing the sob story on American Idol or The Voice every season. Emotional manipulation shouldn't be allowed.", ">\n\nAlso can they cut it with the dramatic music in reality shows like Hell's kitchen?", ">\n\nThe emotional drama unfortunately drives views. There are definitely people who watch to see what the performers can do, but all of those shows inject drama because it keeps everyone else engaged. That’s also why you have the same tropes of terrible performances for the sake of comedy across all of these shows. They know who makes up the core of their audience, and they know how to keep them engaged.", ">\n\nAmerican Idol and So You Think You can Dance were the worst.", ">\n\nProducers make them do this lol. It’s part of the show", ">\n\nI’m pretty sure in order to even be considered for a talent show you need some sob background story.", ">\n\nPretty sure the show is encouraging them to have bullshit backstories. I mean they may be real, but besides the sympathy vote, they want to make people into an identifiable character one way or another. It’s like when they have bullshit drama on wrestling. They could just have big dudes “fighting” each other, but no, they want you to know something about these people and feel like you have a reason to root for certain people or hate others.", ">\n\nEveryone has a sob story.", ">\n\nAre you under the impression they are forcing the show to share the stories?", ">\n\nAgree. I don’t care about a sob story. I want to see the talent. If the sob story contestant has the best talent, they should be able to win off that alone, I don’t want to hear the rest. Everyone on the planet has to overcome obstacles. If I’m watching a talent show, I want to see the talent, and want to see the most talented person win off of talent alone.", ">\n\nHonestly I think that part is scripted to happen because it's not about the judges but the people watching the show. Most \"reality\" tv shows are pre-scripted for certain things to happen and they have people working towards guiding things in the right directions.", ">\n\nif a talent show judge had a dollar for every “my mom died and i’m doing this for her because i know she’s watching over me every day”, they’d be able to repay the national debt", ">\n\n“I was born completely naked in front of multiple adults… it was so traumatizing that I didn’t speak for months”", ">\n\nThis is why I stopped watching AGT", ">\n\nMy sister's friend's uncle died of cancer, and their last dying wish was for me to use my voice to become rich and famous.", ">\n\nI like to edit these down to just the performances. I rarely care about their backstory and I never care what the judges think lol", ">\n\nA lot of shows like that wont even consider you as a candidate if you dont have a sob story...\nTalent shows arent charity shows, they're TALENT shows.", ">\n\nreality shows are completely staged. All of them.", ">\n\nIt’s why I stopped watching America’s Got Talent. There were some really cool acts that went on the show but the judges always gave preference to some mediocre singer with a sob story. There are plenty of singing shows, let them go there. Leave AGT for acts that are interesting and unique, that don’t have an outlet elsewhere.", ">\n\nYes.. I can't stand the singing in AGT. \nI quite enjoyed their AGT Extreme season because there was no singing.", ">\n\nI must have given up before they did that because I didn’t even know that was a thing.", ">\n\nIt was only one season I think, 2021. It was outdoor, extreme sport stuff. \nA guy whose stage name is Wheelz was on it and now he's a Hot Wheel so that's neat.\nThere were also a couple hilariously stupid acts. Worth a YouTube search to see a few of the acts.", ">\n\nIt’s not for the judges it’s for the audience. All of that shit is prescreened, not much reality in reality tv.", ">\n\nThis is just band talent shows. If you have a talent with sharing with the world just start doing it or don't bother why does everyone have to get on TV or the internet to feel special?", ">\n\nYou...you realize that these are shows right? People have come off talking about it from all angles, basically some people with talent are told to fake back stories, some people are made to look worse, etc. It's not an actual competition, there's a reason like 3 winners of these things have ever made something of it.", ">\n\nPeople who make posts here wanting to ban something they personally dislike should be banned.", ">\n\nI quit watching those shows because of this. If nothing else, they have the “I was bullied” to fall back on.", ">\n\nmy cat meant the world to me. he’s the one that taught me to sing. But a robber came and stole him and killed my family and burned my house and chopped off my left pinky finger. I didn’t know what to do. So I came to the show to sing and continue the legacy of my cat. I know it’s what Mr. Meow would have wanted. Now he’s watching me from kitcat heaven and I know he is real dang proud", ">\n\nBut what about all the stuttering army carnies?", ">\n\nVery cool, unpopular opinion!", ">\n\nIMO people with sad pasts tend to be more talented. Or at least they fostered their talent better. \nBut I do agree with you, sob points should not be counted.", ">\n\nIt’s cringey", ">\n\nI'm not a fan of \"banning\" much of anything, but people do need to seriously stop watching so much garbage entertainment. It is rotting your brain and eroding society.", ">\n\nOmg how did that B word get by the mod lol", ">\n\nBan it\nOutlaw it\nFine it\nThat's all people want to do with shit they don't like.", ">\n\nSeeeeriously, I fuckin hate it and my wife and I always make jokes about it. tears up “I was born with all my digits…” buzz YOU WIN", ">\n\nIsn't it a requirement for talent show contestants to cry on cue?", ">\n\nThat's 50% of Instagram.", ">\n\nI wont watch Talent shows now as I dont want to watch bullshit sob stories....", ">\n\nKeep in mind that most of what you see on talent shows is heavily scripted and edited. Those contestants who share their emotional stories are most likely asked by the producers of the show for the latter's own content.\nHere's another unpopular opinion: talent shows should be banned because of what some of the \"contestants\" have to go through", ">\n\nHuh ?", ">\n\nWell, for example, remember Zoe Alexander? The woman on Britan's X-Factor who screamed at the judges and attacked the camera operator? She shared her own story", ">\n\nThanks I have the video playing now !", ">\n\nI seriously hate the background info section of contestants part of the show.\nI really couldn't care less, just show me what you can do and let's judge you off of your merits", ">\n\nHahaha, you can't win without something sad in your back story", ">\n\nThey should be but they won’t because audiences love to see these stories (usually in isolation and not every single contestant). \nEvery now and then it’s cool to see a story of someone overcoming adversity but when people are trying to win a competition they know this formula works so then you just have everyone trying to weave the worst thing that’s ever happened to them into their story.", ">\n\nIts part of why some people end up famous in general. So why should it be banned?", ">\n\nThat's what the show producers want. I'm sure they go looking for story first and then be like hey by the way any talents?", ">\n\nYou're definitely not talking about broadcast talent shows are you? That shit is the bread and butter and scripted for millions. Have you done any research on any reality talent shows? I wouldn't call this an unpopular opinion as I would a barely held secret.", ">\n\nThat's part of the act Jimbo. To the point of some contestant fabricating their sad stories on the spot, because it ups your chances of being taken to the next round", ">\n\nThe producers push them to have stories.", ">\n\nHonestly I really want a contestant to take the piss, \nA contestant to say a made up sob story even tho they have been told not to", ">\n\nI agree with your post to some extent, but talent shows related to literature should allow sob stories as long as they are relevant to their prompts and not used to blackmail examiners.", ">\n\nthey are convincing viewers, not judges", ">\n\nPeople have already addressed it's done on purpose for ratings, but the other truth is that honestly, there's not a lot of things you can do these days that warrant oos and ahhs anymore. In the medieval times up until the 1950's or so you could get on stage and get cheers for doing handstand pushups, or breathing fire or cutting an assistant in half. Now it's old hat and without the sob stories you're left with parlor tricks that can't compare to the marvel movies you see, a group of singers and dance routines that, if you're a dancer, are pretty lackluster, but large scale.", ">\n\nI hate trauma dumping and all that emotional back story stuff but I think most of the time it’s the producers pushing that not the contestant. A long, long time ago my cousin participated in one of those shows and they told her point blank talent wise she would go one but they need her to bring some sort of interesting backstory/struggle/family drama. She said no and didn’t go on in the process as they where quite pushy about it.", ">\n\nAnother lasting ding from the Writer's strike years ago.\nWhen you have contestants that come with their own story and judges reacting to them and their performance off the cuff, you don't have to pay writers.", ">\n\nAnd these days normal people have started to mimic this. Think they need backstories and feel the need to share with everyone they meet.", ">\n\nEven all the way back in the early 2010s, America's Got Talent had this problem. The winners of the show went from puppeteers, dance groups, illusionists to generic teenage singer #376 whose mom has cancer or some shit. Like, I'm sorry your life sucks & I do hope it gets better. But I'm not here to watch sad sob stories and decent singing, I'm here to be entertained by insane & unique talents.", ">\n\nI mean, the emotional “blackmail” isn’t for the judges… it’s for you, the audience. A If you read a lot of these talent show contracts (big examples in the UK being X-Factor and Britain’s Got Talent), they literally reserve the right to basically make up a backstory for you.", ">\n\nOr….", ">\n\nCrying as well", ">\n\nThe show directs and stages the shit out of those ‘talent’ shows to have more than another singing head. Everyone thinking production happens on those contestants is stupid.", ">\n\nYeah pretty much all talent shows are tragic backstory contests.", ">\n\nYou realize that the tv shows plan these emotional stories to gather views right?", ">\n\nI do agree most are emotional stories to get them more empathy. And that has zero to do with set talent. And should be judged only by set talent.", ">\n\nExcept you're missing the entire point OP.\nIt's not the talent who's using the story. It's the producers pushing the use of said stories.\nIt's all fake and reality tv. Thats how this shit works. Anyone going on these shows is NOT looking for a quick 5mins of fame. It's all for a tick on the acting/singer resume as being contestants on these shows is considered a requirement for certain roles.", ">\n\nThe shows exist to make money and emotional stories get more viewers. Simple as that.", ">\n\nThe shows producers WANT these stories. They will never ban it lmao", ">\n\nMy favorite part of those shows is the person who has a complete wreck of a life but has has voice of an angel. \nNow when they suck I'm on your side OP, but I enjoy the level of perseverance and victory that comes from someone being so low and achieving their \"dream\".", ">\n\nYou think tv talent shows care about talent?", ">\n\nI upvote!", ">\n\nMy favorite was AGT during the height of COVID. \nThis group of nurses formed a choir and it was okayish.. better than me and they'd do well at a church. \nbut their sob story was all about COVID work etc and I'm like \"BUT you have time to travel to be in a talent show !?!\" like what ? \n98% sure they weren't even nurses. and they wore scrubs on stage. everyone went wild exclusively because of the story. so obnoxious.", ">\n\nRATINGS, MOTHERFUCKER!", ">\n\nNo kidding. Save it for Oprah and just sing, dance, or do a card trick. \nI'd also like them to ban the \"lame duck\" contestants who have no chance of winning but they take the slot of some act that was way better and serious.", ">\n\nThat's also how they pick most of the contestants you see on The Price Is Right, believe it or not. While the audience is waiting outside to go into the studio some of the staff will gab it up with the crowd and they tend to go for the ones with the most compelling stories.", ">\n\nAbsolutely agree. I used to watch America's got talent but stopped because I almost flawlessly predicted who would go through every time and it was primarily based on sob stories.", ">\n\nPeople want to see the most entertaining performers, not the most talented performers.", ">\n\nI usually just fast forward all the “life stories”", ">\n\nyeah, I can agree with this, if it’s just emotional shit, I mean sure it’s sad but if it’s not actual talent, throw them the fuck out.", ">\n\nThe place I noticed this the most was in American Ninja Warrior. 9 times out of 10, anyone with an emotional backstory attached to them will either finish the course or at the very least, fail in some late stages with the hosts acting surprised.", ">\n\nI agrée but i think this is on the show, not the contestant. I feel line every show has gone off the rails after a few seasons to the sob stories.", ">\n\nA person's story is part of what makes them, its much better than just some superficial surface level image", ">\n\nIf they only showed the performances the show would be 20 mins max. Actually that might make for a better show.", ">\n\nThey don't \"use emotional stories to convince judges.\" They are told to by producers. There have been many Xfactor contestants who have come out and said producers spun a bogus sobstory for them.", ">\n\nThe only \"real\" acts on these shows are the bad ones. The others are explicitly directed by the show producers.\nThere are stories of bad acts finding out that they were invited soley to be made fun of on stage.", ">\n\nI wouldn’t be surprised if the sob stories on talent shows are made up by the producers themselves", ">\n\nThe system of the show encourages them in the first place. Judges own record labels and they want to sell the artists. There is no blackmail because these shows are designed for naive people to get invested in contestants stories and then spend their money on them. \nExample - Black Mirror - Fifteen Million Merits" ]

[]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call.", ">\n\nHi! I’m Big Butt Skinner!" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call.", ">\n\nHi! I’m Big Butt Skinner!", ">\n\nSo we know its not a weather device." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call.", ">\n\nHi! I’m Big Butt Skinner!", ">\n\nSo we know its not a weather device.", ">\n\nIf it was a weather device can't they just land it and ask for it back. 🤥" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call.", ">\n\nHi! I’m Big Butt Skinner!", ">\n\nSo we know its not a weather device.", ">\n\nIf it was a weather device can't they just land it and ask for it back. 🤥", ">\n\nHonestly I think it would be more believable if they just said it was an attempt to reach us about our car's extended warranty." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call.", ">\n\nHi! I’m Big Butt Skinner!", ">\n\nSo we know its not a weather device.", ">\n\nIf it was a weather device can't they just land it and ask for it back. 🤥", ">\n\nHonestly I think it would be more believable if they just said it was an attempt to reach us about our car's extended warranty.", ">\n\n“Bogey’s airspeed not sufficient for intercept, suggest we get out and walk”" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call.", ">\n\nHi! I’m Big Butt Skinner!", ">\n\nSo we know its not a weather device.", ">\n\nIf it was a weather device can't they just land it and ask for it back. 🤥", ">\n\nHonestly I think it would be more believable if they just said it was an attempt to reach us about our car's extended warranty.", ">\n\n“Bogey’s airspeed not sufficient for intercept, suggest we get out and walk”", ">\n\nThat was a really interesting read. Thanks!" ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call.", ">\n\nHi! I’m Big Butt Skinner!", ">\n\nSo we know its not a weather device.", ">\n\nIf it was a weather device can't they just land it and ask for it back. 🤥", ">\n\nHonestly I think it would be more believable if they just said it was an attempt to reach us about our car's extended warranty.", ">\n\n“Bogey’s airspeed not sufficient for intercept, suggest we get out and walk”", ">\n\nThat was a really interesting read. Thanks!", ">\n\nThats why stratotankers did some circles near the Montana/Dakota border. Transponders are going on and off." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call.", ">\n\nHi! I’m Big Butt Skinner!", ">\n\nSo we know its not a weather device.", ">\n\nIf it was a weather device can't they just land it and ask for it back. 🤥", ">\n\nHonestly I think it would be more believable if they just said it was an attempt to reach us about our car's extended warranty.", ">\n\n“Bogey’s airspeed not sufficient for intercept, suggest we get out and walk”", ">\n\nThat was a really interesting read. Thanks!", ">\n\nThats why stratotankers did some circles near the Montana/Dakota border. Transponders are going on and off.", ">\n\nIf it weren't for the fact that China has been busted numerous times for random \"citizens\" on tours taking pictures of government facilities or how we find Chinese police stations with the sole purpose of monitoring their citizens abroad; we might buy it. But no, this is yet another mass surveillance device. Question remains on who? They really can't stand their people closing outside their country and talking shit about them." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call.", ">\n\nHi! I’m Big Butt Skinner!", ">\n\nSo we know its not a weather device.", ">\n\nIf it was a weather device can't they just land it and ask for it back. 🤥", ">\n\nHonestly I think it would be more believable if they just said it was an attempt to reach us about our car's extended warranty.", ">\n\n“Bogey’s airspeed not sufficient for intercept, suggest we get out and walk”", ">\n\nThat was a really interesting read. Thanks!", ">\n\nThats why stratotankers did some circles near the Montana/Dakota border. Transponders are going on and off.", ">\n\nIf it weren't for the fact that China has been busted numerous times for random \"citizens\" on tours taking pictures of government facilities or how we find Chinese police stations with the sole purpose of monitoring their citizens abroad; we might buy it. But no, this is yet another mass surveillance device. Question remains on who? They really can't stand their people closing outside their country and talking shit about them.", ">\n\n\nChina has been busted numerous times for random \"citizens\" on tours taking pictures of government facilities\n\nEvery world power does this." ]

[ "Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.\nIf you are worried about \"spy balloons\" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake.", ">\n\nI really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.\n​\nEdit: Oh how wrong I was.", ">\n\nLol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh", ">\n\nDad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool", ">\n\nThey were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live.", ">\n\nShitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP.", ">\n\nFor sure. The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese. Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation. There was also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.", ">\n\n\nand viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.\n\nwell, they weren't wrong about that", ">\n\nGuess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir.", ">\n\nIf it really is a weather balloon, the answer is \"Why bother?\"\nIt's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons.", ">\n\nGiven that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon.", ">\n\nYeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \\~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days?", ">\n\nAlso I don't think they are usually this large right?", ">\n\nA weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. \nThis thing has something the size of a couple of school busses.", ">\n\nMost spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things", ">\n\nWeather is of great importance for military operations.\nThe Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. \nAlso, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public.", ">\n\nThe sun gives away periscopes more than radar.", ">\n\nWhat like it just hands them out for free? Damn.", ">\n\nWell, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations.", ">\n\nPlus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place.", ">\n\nI'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering.", ">\n\nLinger over an area for significant periods of time.", ">\n\nsome satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want", ">\n\nYes and they very expensive, a balloon less so", ">\n\nyes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to \"protect\" the country from them", ">\n\nCCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.\nMight as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll.", ">\n\nThat was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet.", ">\n\nI think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it?", ">\n\nIt flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22.", ">\n\nService ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.\nDownvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read.", ">\n\nService ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. \nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.", ">\n\nI never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.\n\nFor example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.\n\nAnother straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\\~8,000.\nMy point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: \"service ceiling\" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around.", ">\n\nCouple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. \nActually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. \nSo while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner, seems like a pretty big red flag to me.\nIt's probably a spy thing.", ">\n\nIsn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it? If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course?", ">\n\nA 100% private company in China?", ">\n\nThat’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon.", ">\n\nMy question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it.", ">\n\nIt says “Made in China” at the bottom lol", ">\n\nyeah, but our balloons say \"made in china\" on them too, right?", ">\n\nIf it's a civilian balloon yeah.", ">\n\nSo nice of China to be concerned about our weather.", ">\n\nI’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course.", ">\n\nProbably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.\nEdit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument", ">\n\n\nI just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,\n\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\n\nIf it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.\n\n\n\nthere’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t\n\nIt can provide persistent coverage over a location. The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot.", ">\n\n\nSteering control can be done by change altitude\n\nInteresting - how does one go about planning such a trip?", ">\n\nI mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.\nRemember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s.", ">\n\nWell now we know they aren't trying to learn anything.", ">\n\nFor anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use.", ">\n\nLooks like they just shot one down over Montana.", ">\n\n@realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed", ">\n\nMy attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while \"vacationing\" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!\nIn any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.", ">\n\n\nNo need to start a war over this.\n\nSaid no warpig ever.", ">\n\nEven they don't want direct war between nuclear powers. Kind of hard to make money when everyone's dead.", ">\n\nJust like when Russia building their troops along Ukraine border and claimed it was for military exercises.", ">\n\n\"Weather Device\" air quotes Dr. Evil.", ">\n\nGreat, now China knows I still haven't scooped the dog poop in the back yard.", ">\n\nIt’s okay, none of my neighbors pick up their dogs shit either", ">\n\nIf this really was a spy device then we can stop worrying about China as peer adversary.", ">\n\nDon't be so quick to dismiss low-tech solutions. Sometimes they're the right call.", ">\n\nHi! I’m Big Butt Skinner!", ">\n\nSo we know its not a weather device.", ">\n\nIf it was a weather device can't they just land it and ask for it back. 🤥", ">\n\nHonestly I think it would be more believable if they just said it was an attempt to reach us about our car's extended warranty.", ">\n\n“Bogey’s airspeed not sufficient for intercept, suggest we get out and walk”", ">\n\nThat was a really interesting read. Thanks!", ">\n\nThats why stratotankers did some circles near the Montana/Dakota border. Transponders are going on and off.", ">\n\nIf it weren't for the fact that China has been busted numerous times for random \"citizens\" on tours taking pictures of government facilities or how we find Chinese police stations with the sole purpose of monitoring their citizens abroad; we might buy it. But no, this is yet another mass surveillance device. Question remains on who? They really can't stand their people closing outside their country and talking shit about them.", ">\n\n\nChina has been busted numerous times for random \"citizens\" on tours taking pictures of government facilities\n\nEvery world power does this.", ">\n\nNYPD also has international offices and it's really as ridiculous as that sounds." ]